Written by: Dr. Nilesh Satguru, Executive Contributor
Executive Contributors at Brainz Magazine are handpicked and invited to contribute because of their knowledge and valuable insight within their area of expertise.
Professor Kristin Neff is the world’s leading pioneer in self-compassion. She is an Associate Professor at the University of Texas and received her doctorate from Berkeley. Kristen has published over 50 academic articles and has been cited over 35,000 times.
What is truly fascinating about her work is how she brought the first academic studies of self-compassion to light. She set up the Center for Mindful Self-Compassion with Chris Germer, wrote a workbook with him too, and her newest book, ‘Fierce Self-Compassion’, is out now.
In this open, personal interview we delve deep into why entrepreneurs need self-compassion and the pivotal stories behind Kristen’s work.
You can listen to the full interview via this link.
1. Kristen, what work projects are you most excited about in the coming weeks and months?
I'm retiring from academia. I'll still be writing articles but I'm really focusing full-time on disseminating self-compassion in the world. At the Center for Mindful Self-Compassion, we teach an abundance of self-compassion training programmes.
We've run a basic programme, called ‘Mindful Self-Compassion’, and now we're adapting it for health care, teens, children, parents, couples, athletes and the workplace.
“My mission in life is to spread self-compassion throughout the world.”
It's not just the idea of self-compassion, it's the practice. I love finding concrete, easy-to-use tools that people can use in their daily life to help them alleviate their own suffering.
It's incredibly exciting, and I think the next project is working on a book for burnout because burnout is such a problem in the world today.
2. I've been hugely inspired by your work Kristin. I recently presented at the British Society of Lifestyle Medicine conference, and we spoke about how self-compassion prevents burnout. What is the effect self-compassion has on motivation?
Short-term self-criticism may work to get your attention but, in the long term, it undermines you because it creates performance anxiety and fear of failure.
“The biggest problem with self-criticism as a motivator is that it stops you learning from your mistakes because you're so consumed with shame.”
You become so self-focused. Whereas if you say, ‘Ok, well, it's only human to make mistakes, it happens to everyone. What can I learn from this? How can I grow?’, that’s much more effective in the long run.
Especially in business contexts – they say failure is your best teacher, yet no one is willing to fail because of their self-esteem. Instead, it can be framed as ‘Ok, failure is a teacher, everyone fails, I’m going to be kind and supportive to myself.’
It's not kind or supportive to yourself just to say, ‘Oh well, I'm a failure.’ That's not kind! What’s kind is, ‘How can I learn, how can I grow, how can I do better next time?’ It’s saying, ‘I'm okay, but maybe my behaviour can change.’
“It's separating your worth as a person from your performance, which we absolutely want to change to be the best it can be, precisely because we care, not because we’re inadequate.”
3. Self-compassion helps you fall forward by understanding that everyone makes mistakes. How did you get into self-compassion Kristen? Self-compassion is very aligned with Buddhist concepts. Is that how you came to learn about it?
Yes, it was. But I think self-compassion is a secular concept. We don’t need to have any sort of particular religion or philosophy to practice it. I learnt about it when I started practising mindfulness meditation with Thich Nhat Hanh, a Buddhist teacher who talks a lot about the importance of self-compassion.
I think most people know that compassion is something Buddhists talk about a lot. If you believe in interdependence, and that we're all part of a larger whole, then it makes absolutely no sense to give compassion outward and not inward, right?
Including yourself in the circle of compassion – seeing how your suffering, your struggles and your mistakes are part of a larger interdependent whole, that’s the broader view. Call it common humanity, call it universality, you can call it interdependence, it doesn't matter what you call it – but it's not just YOU.
Ironically, even though we call it ‘self-compassion’, what it's really pointing to is relating to yourself in not such a separate way. It’s almost like there is no self-compassion if you take it far enough.
“Wisdom tells me I am nothing. Love tells me I am everything. And between the two my life flows.”
Nisargadatta Maharaj
4. I love the beauty of that quote. I wonder if you could define what you mean by self-compassion?
Yes. So there are three components of self-compassion, at least in my definition; not everyone defines compassion the same way as I do.
The first component is mindfulness or presence. We need to be present with ourselves – we need to be present with our emotional difficulty, we need to be able to turn toward feelings about weakness or inadequacy or struggle in general.
Instead, we put our heads in the sand, or we don't acknowledge it, or we go overboard and get lost in it.
And then, common humanity. This is what differentiates self-compassion from self-pity. It’s not for me. It is realising everyone makes mistakes, everyone is doing the best they can, and everyone struggles.
And self-kindness, which is warmth, support, care, and encouragement.
“When you're with yourself with compassion, you are in a state of loving, connected presence.”
The cool thing is, you give it to yourself. It's great when someone in our life can give it to us, but that may not always be possible.
5. What are the benefits of self-compassion for entrepreneurs?
We have an evolved care system – it's called the ‘tend and befriend’’ response, which is different to the ‘fight, flight or freeze response. It increases heart rate variability, releases oxytocin and opiates. As a result, we feel cared for and feel we belong.
This physiological act is really important, in reducing cortisol for instance. Increased heart rate variability allows you to respond flexibly to challenges, which is excellent for an entrepreneur.
“If you are in distress and you're blaming yourself and others, you aren't going to be able to look around you and think ‘what are the opportunities here?’ But if you're more flexible, you are able to take advantage of opportunities.”
And so, when you practice self-compassion, that means you actually tap into your own care system. You turn towards yourself, as you would to a good friend, and say:
‘This is really hard, I’m sorry. Is there anything I can do to help? You aren't alone. There's nothing wrong with you, this just happens as part of being human. But I really want to help you.’
“You turn that lens of kindness for yourself. It is a superpower that changes your physiology. It helps you see more clearly. It helps you be less overwhelmed with stress, distress and shame. It helps you function more effectively as a human being.”
This is something we all have in our own back pockets – we're born with this evolved care system as human beings. We think about using it for others, but we forget that we can also use it for ourselves.
6. Kristen, what practices would you recommend any entrepreneur to engage with?
There are meditations which help, but not everyone is into meditation, not everyone has time to meditate. Simple things like putting your hand on your heart, shoulder or face, or any gesture of kindness can help.
“Babies, for the first two years of life, the primary way parents communicate care is through physical touch. So our bodies evolve to interpret warm, supported touch as the signal of care.”
You can just give yourself a little pat on the shoulder or hold your heart or stomach. It changes your physiology. It reduces cortisol levels.
You may be in the middle of a difficult meeting where maybe you don't want to put your hand on your heart in front of the other board members. But, maybe a hand on your stomach underneath the table or holding your own hand with the intent to support yourself, this changes your physiology in a helpful way.
Another easy thing, we call it the self-compassion break. In other words, you can take a little break from the overwhelming feeling or from the distress you’re feeling by just intentionally calling in the three components of compassion – mindful awareness, common humanity and self-kindness.
7. Kristen, how has your purpose evolved from researcher to thought leader?
I learnt about self-compassion from a Thich Nhat Hanh group that I was studying with. Then I got a position at the University of Texas at Austin. I had been doing some work as a postdoc with self-esteem, studying the downsides of self-esteem.
“And I thought self-compassion is a better alternative to self-esteem because it gives you a sense of self-worth, like self-esteem, but it's unconditional, it’s intrinsic. It’s based on being a human being who suffers, as opposed to being successful or looking a certain way.”
So, I decided to create a scale to measure it. I thought, ‘Why not? It can’t hurt!’ I didn't really know what I was doing, but I gave it a shot, and the scale came out pretty well. The research started showing that self-compassion was strongly linked to emotional well-being and other good outcomes.
Then in 2008 I met Chris Germer at a meditation retreat for scientists who were combining contemplative practice with science. And he said, “Kristen, the research is great but you need to figure out how to teach people to be more self-compassionate.” And I said, “I don't know how to do that, you know how to do that!”
So, we really collaborated in that moment. Chris has really been instrumental in this. We've been a real, proper team figuring out ways to help people be more self-compassionate. And that’s what I’m so excited about – teaching people really concrete, useful ways they can do this.
8. That must have been scary to move away from academia, how did you continue to move forward in the face of those fears?
It's kind of complicated, but I've really had to use a lot of self-compassion. I'm not sure whether or not my department is going to grant me emeritus status, which will allow me to continue my research.
There are a lot of challenging emotions. Feeling unappreciated. Also feeling like, if I can't continue to do my research, that wasn't the plan I had. I had planned to take early retirement but continue to do my research. This is the type of situation where I need a lot of self-compassion.
Acknowledging the pain of it and, to be honest, there’s some anger. I feel like I haven't been treated fairly. But I also use fierce self-compassion.
So, self-compassion isn't just about acceptance of oneself but, if you're being treated unjustly, it means standing up and saying this isn’t alright. It's a matter of opening to the pain, giving yourself the warmth, kindness and support you need, remembering that you aren't alone.
I’m certainly not the only one in a hierarchical institution who had these types of struggles – it’s part of life. And telling yourself that helps, so you are not thinking ‘why me?’’
“I use self-compassion every day. It's a way of life really because every day you suffer in some way. Just getting older, even if it's some little aches or pains or things stop working as well as they used to. Compassion is the way we approach any form of distress.”
9. You’ve been cited over 35,000 times and published over 50 academic articles. Where did your motivation and desire come from, specifically in relation to your parents? Did they instil that in you from a young age?
My parents were both very spiritual so I was introduced to Eastern spirituality from a very young age. I used to go to the Paramahansa Yogananda Self-Realization Fellowship Sunday school when I was little, so those ideas were always kind of around me.
And, I think that shaped me in the sense that I had that idea of more of a spiritual purpose to my life.
The idea that it’s not just this material world with success in terms of achievements. It was a bigger purpose. A desire to awaken, you might say. It sounds so grandiose, but I think we all have this desire to understand the nature of reality and our place in the world and the meaning of things. I think that was always there.
In some ways, it was almost happenstance. I just happened to hit on something – self-compassion. It hadn’t been done before.
“But I'm just a messenger. I mean, self-compassion sells itself.”
Yes, I've written articles and I have contributed. I don't want to belittle what I've done. But it's not me who’s making the difference – it's self-compassion that is making a difference.
10. For entrepreneurs, relationships are everything. The entrepreneur who treats their customers like their friends and loved ones is one that is most authentic. How has your research of self-compassion affected how you approach relationships?
“One of the things that self-compassion does give you, and the research really shows this, is authenticity.”
You are less focused on people liking you. You are more focused on liking yourself. You can really be yourself and that allows you to take risks. It allows you to be less dependent on others – you can be a lot of your own needs. I think that really helps some relationships when you're less dependent on others.
It also helps like right now, for instance, I'm divorced. I'm single. As a woman, that's really scary. You can be Beyoncé – Beyoncé’s still worried about being single! For a woman to be single in this society is to be less valuable. Historically we've got hundreds of years of history saying that if you're single, you are a spinster, an old maid.
Self-compassion has helped me actually learn to not be in a relationship. If it happens it's great – I'm open to it if it comes along. But so often we feel we need to complete ourselves in another person, that an intimate relationship is how we become whole. It's helped me to realise I'm whole whether I'm in or out of a relationship. I don't need a relationship to be whole.
My wholeness comes from connection with the universe, not with a particular person. It helps you be more self-sufficient in a relationship so you can give more, but it also helps you become less dependent on a relationship for happiness.
Loneliness is such an epidemic in our society. Of course, we need other people. But, with self-compassion, you are less dependent on other people to meet your needs, which gives you a lot of power.
11. One thing I noticed in your book ‘Self-compassion’, was how incredibly honest you were about personal struggles that you've had in relationships with your son Rowan. Did you struggle to write about such painful topics? Was there any fear of judgement?
Oh yeah, it was terrifying! I really aired my dirty laundry. And I'm a pretty private person by nature so I didn't enjoy that process at all. But I knew I had to do it.
My colleague Chris Germer, he's a therapist and he wrote a self-compassion book. So he could talk about his clients and these stories. I wasn't a therapist. I didn't have all these stories. But I had stories of my personal life. And so I knew that, to make it accessible, I needed to tell real stories.
And the other thing I knew is that, if I came off as this totally put-together self-compassion guru who is going to help these poor people with these struggles, that would not work.
I needed to relate my common humanity. So, I did it and I shared my stories because I knew it would be effective in explaining things and showing people how self-compassion would help.
12. Well, those stories moved me to tears as it was so relatable to my son Freddie. Thank you for sharing so openly. Something I'm interested in is legacy. What's the legacy, Kristen, that you would like to leave on the world?
I feel like, if I were to die tomorrow, I would have done enough. I'd be on my deathbed thinking, ‘I'm satisfied’. My legacy is bringing self-compassion into the common culture, and having it spread and people understanding that this is a resource they have available that they didn't realise.
It's not rocket science. ‘Give myself the same warmth, kindness and support I’d give to a good friend? I can do that!’ It can be challenging for some people but at least acknowledging the idea that it's possible. Just even having that really change the culture is huge.
Dr. Nilesh Satguru, Executive Contributor Brainz Magazine
Nilesh is a certified high-performance coach, speaker and lifestyle medicine doctor. His mission is to inspire a community to Believe In Growth. After witnessing his father’s illnesses, his son's developmental challenges and resigning from a medical partnership, Nilesh dedicated himself to self-mastery to serve others.
With his coaching business, Nilesh helps entrepreneurs and executives perform at their best so they can create exceptional lives and serve their community.
In the world of medicine, Nilesh is a four-time award-winning medical teacher, a director for the British Society of Lifestyle Medicine, a lecturer at Southampton University, and he sits on the UK's national sleep steering committee.
Nilesh's aims to spread a message of compassion, openness, challenge and growth through all his endeavours.
